You don't' include the veterans who died in Veterans Day? I always did. Even though my Dad was a vet who happily survived, he always felt it was those who didn't make it home who deserved the credit and the focus. Please don't continue the 'Hey, a picture of a dead soldier, now's my chance to correct him!' That will say more than you might wish it would.
Yes. Where does it say only live veterans be honored and not those who have passed on this holiday? It doesn't mean only the ones who died in battle but those who have died from wounds or old age. They are still veterans and will be honored in my household.
Nope. And I don't include the Saints on All Souls Day.
Please don't continue the, "Hey, let's put all the patriotic holidays in a blender and press puree!" That will say more than you might wish it would.
The point of having different holidays is not to keep observing the same thing multiple times throughout the year, but to observe different things. Christmas is not Easter, and vice versa. Mother's Day is not Father's Day. Once you start with, "All holidays are just celebrations of everything good!" they rapidly become days when you actually celebrate nothing at all. No. A bride should be celebrated at her wedding; it is not a time to celebrate all the women equally. A child should be celebrated on his birthday, not all the children equally.
I'm not blending and mixing. See that soldier? That's why we celebrate Veterans Day. Because veterans don't go into a situation where it's candy, games and fun. They could, and often do, die. That was my Dad's observation. It's because of the ones who didn't come home that we celebrate the ones who did. If being a veteran was fun and games, what's to celebrate? But because it isn't, because of the awful price veterans pay, and the ultimate price that many pay, that we celebrate them and what they've done. Again, family of veterans here. But it's that ultimate sacrifice, it's the risk of paying it all and giving it all for the rest of us, that we celebrate.
BTW, it would be helpful if you signed some form of name or ID on your posts. It makes it devilishly difficult to keep track if more than one Anon. poster comes by. Just type it in, as some others have who otherwise haven't or couldn't log into the account (I get that blogger isn't the most user friendly platform).
No, Daffey, we celebrate Veterans Day because World War 1 ended and some of these guys got to go home and live out the rest of their lives. That is worth celebrating! It takes a cold heart to celebrate the deaths of your own soldiers. That's why Memorial Day is OBSERVED, not CELEBRATED.
Veteran's Day is not Memorial Day 2.0 not only because of the object of veneration, but also because of a difference in tone. Way to wreck that, Daffey.
That's still a little problematic, Anonymous. Memorial Day focuses in particular on the deceased, sure. Most observances or celebrations of the Day involve public ceremonies; these usually involve...veterans. They typically receive mention for their particular VFW or Legion post. They may also also receive recognition for their particular fighting unit. I get it about celebrating the living today, v commemorating the dead. Even so, how many of us who served, ..have that much desire to relive it? I wouldn't say my military experience came that terrible; I still have comparatively little desire to dwell on it. Honestly, the more I consider it, the more I could wish we could revert to celebrating an Armistice.
Anon, not Bob, I understand the connection. But as John says, Memorial Day often focuses on the deceased, but often on the general deceased. You ,know, everyone who has passed. I see people in the cemetery on Memorial Day visiting graves that don't look a thing like veterans who died in war. Veterans Day, originally Armistice Day, is set aside to remember Veterans in general, and especially those who died in service. The possibility of dying for ones country always being what adds umph to the respect given to those serving in our military. Hence why so many pictures I'[m seeing are of veterans in general, or of rows of crosses or other similar memorials. The point of the picture is that soldier died and receive respect from those he died to liberate. The essence of what can come from serving in the military. We remember that when we remember Veterans Day because that's what veterans can face when they serve, often face when they serve, and all too often fail to avoid when they serve. That's why we have a special day set aside for veterans as opposed to rock stars or delivery truck drivers.
Eh, FWIW, the US declared Veterans Day in 1954; it had been Armistice Day. ..Incidentally, the French still celebrate the latter this day. Online, I see people DID honor the dead as much as the living this day historically. I get it about Memorial Day being for the deceased. Even so, my extended family decorated many graves with flowers on Memorial Day for deceased relatives. Certainly the three boys who died in infancy had not fought in wars, nor had most others. We still honored their memory. I only learned in my later 20s how Memorial Day had displaced All Souls for this here in America. Then again, where I had mostly paid attention to Halloween from childhood, I hadn't thought much about All Saints v All Souls til quite recently. BTW, if we're going to be technical, we living souls actually fit in the Church Militant, the Communion of Saints being the Church Triumphant.
I notice that as well. Memorial Day is a time to remember those who have passed - everyone who has passed. Yes, focus is on those who died serving our country, but I see plenty of people use Memorial Day for the broader point of remembering everyone who went before. That's why Veterans Day always stuck as that time we specifically remember the veterans, especially those who didn't come back, who symbolize that possible sacrifice veterans always live with. I really didn't think it would be a big thing, and would prefer to reflect on the photo and what it means for remembering vets.
Don't worry about it Dave. Anon is just being contentious. He's knows what we mean and understands it, but wants to us to follow his description of Veterans Day and how we honor them. Reminds me of another fellow named Deco.
Bob, apparently. I paid attention to the emphasis over the weekend and noticed the vast majority of tributes and memorials emphasized the fallen. Sometimes almost exclusively. Always brought up though. Never was it 'we remember all veterans ever' end of statement. At most it was 'we remember veterans today, esp. the fallen.' In one Brit newscast, it actually stated the purpose of the day (Armistice Day there) was to remember those who fell in service to their country. So whatever track Anon who remains Anon was coming from, it doesn't appear to be the majority witness.
As the daughter of a Vietnam vet, I was moved greatly by the observation of WWII pilot Quentin Aanenson, (highlighted in Ken Burns great WWII documentary), who wrote his girlfriend after seeing his good friend die a horrific death: “We are all casualties.” As the friend of an Afghanistan/ Iraq war veteran who took his own life, I’m even more convinced he was right. To serve means to take on a potentially terrible burden for a greater purpose. It’s a noble endeavor. I’m sorry our more recent guys seem to bear a heavier burden engaging in wars with ambiguous moral character. Made worse by the asinine withdrawal of Afghanistan last year and complete middle finger to their sacrifice.
This is true. Someone last year wrote a nice piece on the value of veterans and those who pay the ultimate price for our country, knowing that all civilizations in the end are doomed to die. In some ways, it makes the sacrifice of those here on Earth even more honorable.
No. That is what MEMORIAL DAY is all about.
ReplyDeleteYou don't' include the veterans who died in Veterans Day? I always did. Even though my Dad was a vet who happily survived, he always felt it was those who didn't make it home who deserved the credit and the focus. Please don't continue the 'Hey, a picture of a dead soldier, now's my chance to correct him!' That will say more than you might wish it would.
DeleteYes. Where does it say only live veterans be honored and not those who have passed on this holiday? It doesn't mean only the ones who died in battle but those who have died from wounds or old age. They are still veterans and will be honored in my household.
DeleteNope. And I don't include the Saints on All Souls Day.
DeletePlease don't continue the, "Hey, let's put all the patriotic holidays in a blender and press puree!" That will say more than you might wish it would.
The point of having different holidays is not to keep observing the same thing multiple times throughout the year, but to observe different things. Christmas is not Easter, and vice versa. Mother's Day is not Father's Day. Once you start with, "All holidays are just celebrations of everything good!" they rapidly become days when you actually celebrate nothing at all. No. A bride should be celebrated at her wedding; it is not a time to celebrate all the women equally. A child should be celebrated on his birthday, not all the children equally.
I'm not blending and mixing. See that soldier? That's why we celebrate Veterans Day. Because veterans don't go into a situation where it's candy, games and fun. They could, and often do, die. That was my Dad's observation. It's because of the ones who didn't come home that we celebrate the ones who did. If being a veteran was fun and games, what's to celebrate? But because it isn't, because of the awful price veterans pay, and the ultimate price that many pay, that we celebrate them and what they've done. Again, family of veterans here. But it's that ultimate sacrifice, it's the risk of paying it all and giving it all for the rest of us, that we celebrate.
DeleteBTW, it would be helpful if you signed some form of name or ID on your posts. It makes it devilishly difficult to keep track if more than one Anon. poster comes by. Just type it in, as some others have who otherwise haven't or couldn't log into the account (I get that blogger isn't the most user friendly platform).
DeleteYep. That's why we are called he Communion of Saints.
DeleteYep. That's why we are called he Communion of Saints.
DeleteI was that particular Anon.
Celebrate what you want. If you think we're wrong fine don't celebrate dead veterans on veterans day. As I said we do on our house.
DeleteNo, Daffey, we celebrate Veterans Day because World War 1 ended and some of these guys got to go home and live out the rest of their lives. That is worth celebrating! It takes a cold heart to celebrate the deaths of your own soldiers. That's why Memorial Day is OBSERVED, not CELEBRATED.
DeleteVeteran's Day is not Memorial Day 2.0 not only because of the object of veneration, but also because of a difference in tone. Way to wreck that, Daffey.
That's still a little problematic, Anonymous. Memorial Day focuses in particular on the deceased, sure. Most observances or celebrations of the Day involve public ceremonies; these usually involve...veterans. They typically receive mention for their particular VFW or Legion post. They may also also receive recognition for their particular fighting unit.
DeleteI get it about celebrating the living today, v commemorating the dead. Even so, how many of us who served, ..have that much desire to relive it?
I wouldn't say my military experience came that terrible; I still have comparatively little desire to dwell on it.
Honestly, the more I consider it, the more I could wish we could revert to celebrating an Armistice.
Anon, not Bob, I understand the connection. But as John says, Memorial Day often focuses on the deceased, but often on the general deceased. You ,know, everyone who has passed. I see people in the cemetery on Memorial Day visiting graves that don't look a thing like veterans who died in war. Veterans Day, originally Armistice Day, is set aside to remember Veterans in general, and especially those who died in service. The possibility of dying for ones country always being what adds umph to the respect given to those serving in our military. Hence why so many pictures I'[m seeing are of veterans in general, or of rows of crosses or other similar memorials. The point of the picture is that soldier died and receive respect from those he died to liberate. The essence of what can come from serving in the military. We remember that when we remember Veterans Day because that's what veterans can face when they serve, often face when they serve, and all too often fail to avoid when they serve. That's why we have a special day set aside for veterans as opposed to rock stars or delivery truck drivers.
DeleteEh, FWIW, the US declared Veterans Day in 1954; it had been Armistice Day. ..Incidentally, the French still celebrate the latter this day. Online, I see people DID honor the dead as much as the living this day historically.
ReplyDeleteI get it about Memorial Day being for the deceased. Even so, my extended family decorated many graves with flowers on Memorial Day for deceased relatives. Certainly the three boys who died in infancy had not fought in wars, nor had most others. We still honored their memory. I only learned in my later 20s how Memorial Day had displaced All Souls for this here in America.
Then again, where I had mostly paid attention to Halloween from childhood, I hadn't thought much about All Saints v All Souls til quite recently.
BTW, if we're going to be technical, we living souls actually fit in the Church Militant, the Communion of Saints being the Church Triumphant.
I notice that as well. Memorial Day is a time to remember those who have passed - everyone who has passed. Yes, focus is on those who died serving our country, but I see plenty of people use Memorial Day for the broader point of remembering everyone who went before. That's why Veterans Day always stuck as that time we specifically remember the veterans, especially those who didn't come back, who symbolize that possible sacrifice veterans always live with. I really didn't think it would be a big thing, and would prefer to reflect on the photo and what it means for remembering vets.
DeleteDon't worry about it Dave. Anon is just being contentious. He's knows what we mean and understands it, but wants to us to follow his description of Veterans Day and how we honor them. Reminds me of another fellow named Deco.
DeleteBob, apparently. I paid attention to the emphasis over the weekend and noticed the vast majority of tributes and memorials emphasized the fallen. Sometimes almost exclusively. Always brought up though. Never was it 'we remember all veterans ever' end of statement. At most it was 'we remember veterans today, esp. the fallen.' In one Brit newscast, it actually stated the purpose of the day (Armistice Day there) was to remember those who fell in service to their country. So whatever track Anon who remains Anon was coming from, it doesn't appear to be the majority witness.
DeleteAs the daughter of a Vietnam vet, I was moved greatly by the observation of WWII pilot Quentin Aanenson, (highlighted in Ken Burns great WWII documentary), who wrote his girlfriend after seeing his good friend die a horrific death: “We are all casualties.”
ReplyDeleteAs the friend of an Afghanistan/ Iraq war veteran who took his own life, I’m even more convinced he was right. To serve means to take on a potentially terrible burden for a greater purpose. It’s a noble endeavor. I’m sorry our more recent guys seem to bear a heavier burden engaging in wars with ambiguous moral character. Made worse by the asinine withdrawal of Afghanistan last year and complete middle finger to their sacrifice.
Well said and true.
DeleteThis is true. Someone last year wrote a nice piece on the value of veterans and those who pay the ultimate price for our country, knowing that all civilizations in the end are doomed to die. In some ways, it makes the sacrifice of those here on Earth even more honorable.
Delete